TELECOM 247

> BT states that their (Option1,2,3) inclusive call packages are for
> voice calls to geographic numbers only, calls to geo ISPs are exempt
> and so are charged by the minute.
>
> So do BT class a fax call as voice or data? Anyone got a verifiable
> link or phone bill confirmation (etc)?
>
> For weeding-out ISP calls Im presuming BT has a list of common geo
> ISP dial-ports rather than detecting in-band data tones as per G.165.
> Correct?

>Steve wrote:
>> BT states that their (Option1,2,3) inclusive call packages are for
>> voice calls to geographic numbers only, calls to geo ISPs are exempt
>> and so are charged by the minute.
>>
>> So do BT class a fax call as voice or data? Anyone got a verifiable
>> link or phone bill confirmation (etc)?
>>
>> For weeding-out ISP calls Im presuming BT has a list of common geo
>> ISP dial-ports rather than detecting in-band data tones as per G.165.
>> Correct?
>
>Wrong! The calls to all 01, 02 and 03 prefixes are inclusive. FAX machines
>convert information to what is effectively analogue speech and are decoded
>at the recipient.

> On Sun, 16 Mar 2008 15:33:26 -0000, Peter Crosland
> wrote:
>
>> Steve wrote:
>>> BT states that their (Option1,2,3) inclusive call packages are for
>>> voice calls to geographic numbers only, calls to geo ISPs are exempt
>>> and so are charged by the minute.
>>>
>>> So do BT class a fax call as voice or data? Anyone got a verifiable
>>> link or phone bill confirmation (etc)?
>>>
>>> For weeding-out ISP calls Im presuming BT has a list of common geo
>>> ISP dial-ports rather than detecting in-band data tones as per
>>> G.165. Correct?
>>
>> Wrong! The calls to all 01, 02 and 03 prefixes are inclusive. FAX
>> machines convert information to what is effectively analogue speech
>> and are decoded at the recipient.
>
> Yup, I know how analogue fax machines and modems work. However, from
> BTs Compare Our Calling Plans, T&Cs:
>
> UK calls definition
> --------------------------
>
> UK means Local and National calls of up to an hour to numbers
> beginning 01, 02 and 03. Excluded calls include non-geographic numbers
> (e.g. 0845, 0870), Premium Rate services, operator-controlled calls,
> calls to the internet, information and paging services, local and
> national geographic numbers used to dial up ISPs, other non voice
> calls and calls to the Channel Islands. You can redial after an hour
> to avoid call charges. Other exclusions apply.
>
> So, let me ask another way: is a fax call classed as other non-voice
> calls? And can someone provide proof or disproof?

>Steve wrote:
>> On Sun, 16 Mar 2008 15:33:26 -0000, Peter Crosland
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Steve wrote:
>>>> BT states that their (Option1,2,3) inclusive call packages are for
>>>> voice calls to geographic numbers only, calls to geo ISPs are exempt
>>>> and so are charged by the minute.
>>>>
>>>> So do BT class a fax call as voice or data? Anyone got a verifiable
>>>> link or phone bill confirmation (etc)?
>>>>
>>>> For weeding-out ISP calls Im presuming BT has a list of common geo
>>>> ISP dial-ports rather than detecting in-band data tones as per
>>>> G.165. Correct?
>>>
>>> Wrong! The calls to all 01, 02 and 03 prefixes are inclusive. FAX
>>> machines convert information to what is effectively analogue speech
>>> and are decoded at the recipient.
>>
>> Yup, I know how analogue fax machines and modems work. However, from
>> BTs Compare Our Calling Plans, T&Cs:
>>
>> UK calls definition
>> --------------------------
>>
>> UK means Local and National calls of up to an hour to numbers
>> beginning 01, 02 and 03. Excluded calls include non-geographic numbers
>> (e.g. 0845, 0870), Premium Rate services, operator-controlled calls,
>> calls to the internet, information and paging services, local and
>> national geographic numbers used to dial up ISPs, other non voice
>> calls and calls to the Channel Islands. You can redial after an hour
>> to avoid call charges. Other exclusions apply.
>>
>> So, let me ask another way: is a fax call classed as other non-voice
>> calls? And can someone provide proof or disproof?
>
>FAX calls to normal FAX numbers commencing 01,02 or 03 are just the same as
>voice calls and in my expereince neither BT or other carriers distinguish
>between them. I have never been charged anything other than the normal voice
>call rate by BT or Talktalk for FAX calls to these numbers when I have been
>using an inclsuive call plan. I think you are reading too much into the term
>Non voice calls because both FAX and analogue modem calls are de facto
>voice calls. AFAIK there is method of distinguishing these for billing
>purposes other than bve a table of the recipient numbers.